Pigeon King International
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question
post Sep 23 2007, 12:51 PM
Post #1
 


So why was the thread about Pigeon King International deleted? Who deleted it? What is going on? Who is trying to hide the truth? Is someone being paid off or threatened?

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well...
post Sep 23 2007, 12:54 PM
Post #2
 


...aah hell, it was me :(
The pigeon king gave me 14 chickens to shut up :(
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question
post Sep 23 2007, 12:55 PM
Post #3
 


So how runs this forum? And what does it take to remove a topic? Does anyone know?
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ydvmod
post Sep 23 2007, 01:02 PM
Post #4
 


I deleted it. Almost every out of 20-ish posts had a full footer with detailed company contact info.

I advise you start a new thread and try to not make it turn into an advertisement.
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post Sep 23 2007, 01:05 PM
Post #5
 


The last post was an invitation to Arlan Galbraith of Pigeon King International to sue CrimeBusters Now in order to prove that Pigeon King is not a Ponzi scheme. Why has the thread been deleted? At least 2400 individuals had viewed the thread and many were trying to make a decision about whether to invest in pigeons or not. Why would someone try to suppress this information?
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ydvmod
post Sep 23 2007, 01:06 PM
Post #6
 


I think I made myself clear "question".

I apologize for inconvenience.
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post Sep 23 2007, 01:09 PM
Post #7
 


While you are at it why don't you delete the posts with filth on this Vancouver Forum. It is disgusting to have to read the topic headings on the forum page.
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spring
post Sep 23 2007, 01:16 PM
Post #8
 


yes ydv!1

i think the whole dv is totally disgusted by its own disgustedness!1

and so much so - IT'S DISGUSTING!!!



(um.. yeah..)
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ace
post Sep 23 2007, 01:20 PM
Post #9
 


Are you trying to advertise with that link spring :)  It won't even play for me!
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spring
post Sep 23 2007, 01:20 PM
Post #10
 


lol

awww.. too bad:))
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spring
post Sep 23 2007, 01:22 PM
Post #11
 


link!!
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ace
post Sep 23 2007, 01:24 PM
Post #12
 


Windows Media Player encountered a problem playing that file, spring...  Usually I don't have a problem.  Strange...
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spring
post Sep 23 2007, 01:24 PM
Post #13
 


omg!!!

:`(
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yesnomaybe
post Sep 23 2007, 01:25 PM
Post #14
 


ITunes worked ok
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spring
post Sep 23 2007, 01:26 PM
Post #15
 


that's it ace!

i'm leaving!!! ... have to go really:)

ta:)
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spring
post Sep 23 2007, 01:26 PM
Post #16
 


ps

i heart itunes.
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ace
post Sep 23 2007, 01:26 PM
Post #17
 


spring Posted - 9/23/2007 9:26:07 PM
that's it ace!

i'm leaving!!! ... have to go really:)

ta:)
Fo real?  Take care :)
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well...
post Sep 23 2007, 01:27 PM
Post #18
 


...what am I supposed to do with all these chickens?

...got it!

ow!
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post Sep 25 2007, 01:03 PM
Post #19
 






This post was deleted by moderators at Vancouver Forum. In order that the truth be known we are reposting important excerpts.


posted 9/4/2007 9:27:43 PM by CrimeBustersNow

THE PIGEON KING INTERNATIONAL

The Pigeon King International, with huge ads in a variety of publications and advertising on radio, talk shows, agricultural fairs, etc. is a huge fraudulent Ponzi scheme defrauding retired farmers, young farmers, women and children all over North America.They have moved in on, and targeting the Amish communities in North America. This is not a few hundred or thousands of dollars of fraud we are talking about here; this is reprehensibly 20, 30, 40, 50, 100’s of thousands, even half a million or more in losses individually. And it will collapse, as is the nature of all Ponzi schemes, leaving later investors with no viable market for the $500 a pr. (“special purported pedigree”) pigeons they have been swindled into purchasing.

The worldwide headquarters of this fraud is in Waterloo Ontario. CrimebustersNow is actively pursuing this scam, and the unconscionable money laundering, racketeering crook; Mr. Arlan Galbraith. Again, police are fully aware of this fraud, but have not shut it down nor are they warning the hundreds, and thousands of potential victims in North America and worldwide. That is why CrimebustersNow was created. We are warning potential victims worldwide NOW and fully intend to shut this massive money laundering, racketeering, fraudulent Ponzi scheme down.

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

posted 9/8/2007 11:51:24 PM by CrimeBustersNow

CrimeBustersNow has received no cooperation from either Arlan Galbraith of Pigeon King International or Scotiabank, the financial institution that is knowingly or unwittingly assisting in Galbraith’s money-laundering racketeering activity. It is imperative that this massive fraud be shut down immediately before hundreds more unsuspecting North American farmers, their wives and/or children are swindled for tens of thousands of dollars by this unconscionable white-collar, money laundering crook and racketeer.

It is for those reasons CrimeBustersNow in posting emails that were sent to both Arlan Galbraith and the Scotiabank, Northfield Drive and King Street Branch, Waterloo, Ontario and their Toronto Branch.


August, 20, 2007
CrimeBustersNow

ATTN: Arlan Galbraith:

RE: Illegal Ponzi Scheme and Money Laundering Fraud


Further to our conversation by telephone last week I have now personally concluded an investigation into your Business known as “Pigeon King International”. Any further investigation or evidence gathering will only serve to bolster and support what we have already uncovered.

To put it bluntly, you are operating what for nearly a century now is known as a “Ponzi Scheme.” These schemes are reprehensible in that they defraud unsuspecting and in many instances financially desperate victims out of thousands, tens of thousands even hundreds of thousands of dollars. Some victims lose their entire life savings. Others are inadvertently plunged into debt from which they may never recover.

Young people, in this case young farmers, are defrauded of money they don’t have by arranging financing based upon false credibility -- your duly registered but nonetheless fraudulent “shell corporation” projects. And as bad or perhaps worse, these victims waste years chasing an impossible dream. Many of these frauds result in broken marriages and suicide. In the opinion of many judges it is worse than bank robbery or other violent crimes noting perpetrators of some of these frauds have been given prison sentences of 50 to 100 years in the U.S.

Those in the early stages of these Ponzi schemes who may possibly recover their investment and make a profit become unwitting accomplices to your crime by passing on this reprehensible “business opportunity” to their friends and families who ultimately become the losers. Many, such as those in the Mennonite community where you have introduced this fraud, have spread it throughout their community via their churches. The consequences, when this scheme collapses, will be catastrophic.

Farmers may be persuaded to leave their legitimate farming activities because, as you point out in your propaganda, they must purchase quotas and face regulations -- for example, raising chickens, vis a vis raising racing pigeons and squabing pigeons which is not only unregulated but you offer between $10 and $50 per pigeon “picked up at the farm gate.” That is between at least 1000 and more than 5000% better than chicken farming or any other legitimate farming activity. Others who have good jobs and benefits built up over the years in their “off farm employment” may be persuaded to give up those jobs in pursuit of this fraudulent dream you offer them. That is equally reprehensible.

We have determined that there exists no end market for your product, neither the racing pigeons nor squab pigeons. The payments made to earlier investors come from the money generated from new investors. That in this country and a majority of countries in the free world is illegal. It is noteworthy that it is also illegal in many communist countries. The increase in the prices paid for raising these birds that you tout in your advertising propaganda are artificially set and continually inflated by your company since it is you that arbitrarily decide the “value” of these birds and are the only real “market” that exists for your victims to unload their product.

You indicate that your company is debt free. You claim that it is very successful, that you deal with millions of dollars, and that you have been in business for a number of years. Therefore it is inconceivable that you would have attempted, not long ago, to raise money by offering 18% interest when in your stated financial position you should be able to obtain money at financial lending institutions for a few percentage points over prime rate. That again has all the “ear markings” of a pure non product Ponzi scheme whereby the high interrest rate paid to early “investors” is paid by the proceeds of later investors. The reason you conveyed to me -- that you are conducting this business to help out farmers and others, is a well worn excuse used by many of those perpetrating Pyramid and Ponzi schemes and illegal “network” marketing scams disguised as legitimate business.

I’m willing to discuss this matter further with you, your family, your lawyer, or lawyers, accountant, bank and/or financial institutions you deal with. But the fact is that a simple accounting of your business would reveal that you and your family are operating an enormous Ponzi scheme that is mathematically unsustainable and the intention of CrimeBustersNow is clearly to shut your operation down and return to your victims money they have been defrauded of through your illegal money-laundering and racketeering activities.

These frauds result in enormous damage to families and our country as a whole. Your son and daughter are involved in this scheme with you as it appears to be a “family business.”

Pyramid and Ponzi schemes are related offenses. With that said I would point out the attitude of at least one judge: Judge J. Weinper who wrote in his judgment in R. v. Richardson [1999] O.J. No. 5160 No. 98/04385. . . . “Pyramid schemes are illegal under the laws of Canada. Parliament has chosen to make these schemes illegal.” . . . “ . . . You engagge your son in this activity, as well, and that does cause me concern.”

“A scheme of this nature preys on people’s vulnerabilities and their inability to make more money in a legal fashion. It exposes people to the risk of losing money that they have earned legitimately. And as I said, parliament has set out in the criminal code that this kind of scheme is illegal.”

HELD: The pyramid scheme -reyed on other people’s vulnerabilities and exposed people to the risk of losing their moeny. This type of behavior had to be denounced.


Our advice to you, Mr. Galbraith, is that at this date, August 20, 2007, you immediately cease and desist advertising this money-laundering fraud and cease and desist signing up any further victims in this unlawful scheme; that you contact the RCMP and/or the Federal Competition Bureau and acknowledge that you are conducting a Ponzi scheme and have now been exposed. This action may result in some mitigating circumstances. To do otherwise from this point in time, having been warned, could result in a more severe penalty if or when you are ultimately convicted of conducting an illegal Ponzi scheme.

CrimeBustersNow exposes these frauds publicly by any means at our disposal, particularly the internet, where the majority of these frauds are being perpetrated. There are many who are condemning this scheme on the internet. Rumor has it that you will aggressively pursue in the civil courts anyone who defames your company. If you should so choose that option against me be assured I will not, as many who attempt to expose these frauds and schemes, back down in the face of millions in a frivolous and vexatious civil law suit.

David J. Thornton

President CrimeBustersNow


To Scotiabank
King St. & Northfield Drive, Waterloo, Ontario
laurel.watson@scotiabank.com

ATTN: Lorel Watson

RE: Arlan Galbraith and Money-Laundering Ponzi Scheme

Barry Minkow of California, former thief turned fraud investigator, being the youngest person to take a company public and after having defrauded Wall Street investors of some $300,000,000 was asked “Barry, where did we go wrong? What did we miss?” His answer -- “When I paid the security guard $50 to pretend he knew me at the building I walked you through and claimed to be working on, all that was necessary for you to do was to call the owner of the building and ask ‘Do you know Barry Minkow?’ One phone call would have exposed my fraud.” Unfortunately $300,000,000 and seven and a half years in jail later, but now reformed, Barry Minkow exposes fraud in his effort to protect victims and potential victims from scammers through his organization also exposing $1 billion in fraud. CrimeBustersNow is a non-profit organization also exposing and preventing fraud world-wide, located in Oakville, Ontario, Canada.

Canadian authorities including the Ontario Securities Commission, the Federal Competition Bureau, RCMP fraud squad, local fraud squads, prosecutors, Phone Busters, private non-profit organizations such as Crime Stoppers, Better Business Bureau, Chambers of Commerce and the mainline news media are currently under criticism for a dismal job of curtailing white-collar crime (i.e. Macleans Magazine January 30, 2006) and turning their collective backs on money-laundering white collar criminals and failing to snag fraudsters.

The reported statement of the York Region Prosecutor in response to millions in an international pyramid fraud scheme and refusing to act against the perpetrator -- “I am to busy with home invasions and murders to worry about white-collar crime” epitomizes this attitude in Canada. The fact is that this is the only reason CrimeBustersNow exists and the only reason it was created by a small group of angry frustrated seniors. Years of imploring to no avail these agencies to protect seniors, ethnic groups, immigrants, the financially unsophisticated, farmers students in university, college and reprehensibly now even high schools being outright defrauded by sophisticated and corrupt lawyers, accountants, psychologists, current and former police officers, former and current high level government employees, politicians, etc. in a conspiracy with fraudsters to perpetrate one money-laundering, racketeering fraud scheme after another -- particularly those permeating this country and then expanding into global fraud, fell instead on “deaf ears”.

The likes of Alan Kippax, another Canadian fraudster who is at this very point in time spreading a fraud known as Business In Motion across the nation. A fraud a Superior Court Judge ruled on November 30, 2006 to be a prima facie violation of both the Criminal Code and the Federal Competition Act. But notwithstanding, Kippax is again, in plain view of authorities, involving the before-mentioned (excluding the Mennonite Community) and again involving bank employees, even at least one bank manager in his fraud, as he did in his previous fraud -- Treasure Traders International, perpetrated out of Mississauga Ontario. TTI was closed by the High Court of England after only five months of operation when the fraud was attempted in the UK. Now these Canadian government agencies and private, very respected and considered credible non-profit organizations and the mainline media, refuse to adequately warn even university, college and high school students that are again being defrauded by these same liars, crooks, gangsters and thieves. The mainline media are actually advertising many of these fraudulent schemes. That’s just how it is in Canada. As well, Canadian Diamond Traders operating openly in Toronto at 5145 Steeles Avenue West, declared a fraud by the Australian Government, targets students in this country and world-wide. It operates in a brick and mortar building with the knowledge of the RCMP, OPP, Federal Competition Bureau, Metro Police and the Mayor of Toronto. These fraudulent money laundering racketeering schemes are, through inaction, being condoned by authorities in this country.

This is an excerpt from their propaganda. “Canadian Diamond Traders -- Calling all students . . . A legitimate business opportunity which can turn the once-in-a-lifetime investment of $100.00 U.S. into a return on investment of 3000%. This one is so simple, no real effort and it could help pay for your university costs.”

This in the view of the angry and frustrated seniors who created the non-profit organization, CrimeBustersNow is absolutely reprehensible, appalling and distressing.

Today CrimeBustersNow is bringing to the attention of the Fraud Department of the Scotiabank located at the King St. & Northfield Dr. Branch, Waterloo, Ontario, the existence of a mammoth multi-million dollar money laundering, racketeering Ponzi scheme the Scotiabank knowingly or unwittingly is aiding and abetting. When this exponentially expanding Ponzi scheme collapses the results will be catastrophic.

A client of this branch of Scotiabank, a Mr. Arlan Galbraith, founder of Pigeon King International located at Unit #4 - 299 Northfield Drive East Waterloo, Ontario is perpetrating this massive Ponzi scheme. These schemes have been perpetrated using earthworms, ants, fruit; anything fraud artists can think of: Galbraith is doing it with pigeons. Among his other victims he is perpetrating his fraud in Mennonite Communities. The fact that Mennonites will not sue for redress makes this fraud all the more reprehensible.

It is our understanding that financial institutions, particularly lending institutions have in law not only a “Duty of Care” with respect to all their clients but moreover to the interest of the general public. We are also aware that in order to fulfill that “Duty of Care”, suspicion of money-laundering activity must be reported to authorities. It is for that reason CrimeBustersNow is contacting Scotiabank. We believe Scotiabank, acting under it’s fiduciary “Duty of Care” in reporting this money laundering scheme to authorities, will be initiating another significant step in exposing this obvious fraud, resulting in the Pigeon King being rightfully and justly shut down.

CrimeBustersNow has determined that Galbraith has no real viable market for the massive numbers of pigeons he is causing to be produced throughout Canada, the U.S. and possibly other countries as his intention seems to be. And further, that the established price of these birds is not set, nor is it reflected by market conditions, but rather arbitrarily and artificially determined by the “Pigeon King” himself, Galbraith. The inflated prices of these birds from about $80 per pair some three years ago to about $500 per pair are controlled solely by Galbraith, again not by market conditions.

There exists no meat processing plant complete with government inspectors for the killing and processing of “Squabing Pigeons.” The price of $10 per “Squabing Pigeon” Galbraith pays to farmers “at the gate” for these birds would, prima facie, indicate that by the time these birds would be processed they would be priced “out of the marketplace.” Therefore as is manifestly obvious when one conducts even a modicum of investigation into this operation, these birds are not sold for food as is the very nature of “Squabing Pigeons” akin to “Broilers,” but rather sold only within his network of buyers turned producers, definitely another “red flag” indicating a money laundering Ponzi scheme in that the profit made by earlier investors is obtained solely from the money generated by later investors. This type of scheme named for Charles Ponzi almost a century ago is outlawed in this country, the U.S. and most democratic countries as well as many communist countries, and a violation of Section 206 (1) (e) of the Criminal Code of Canada, The federal Competition Act and Section 380 of the C.C.C. under fraud.

The “Homer” pigeons bought for $500 per pair and then sold back to Galbraith for approximately $50 per pair are likewise, according to Galbraith in a recent conversation with CrimeBustersNow, only resold to buyers turned producers in Galbraith’s elaborate, but for accounts, lawyers and those professionally involved in financial markets and law enforcement easily understood scheme.

Galbraith claims to be building up a “breeding stock” and queries “is that illegal?”CrimeBustersNow response is “certainly not, not as long as the payments or profit to earlier ‘investors’ is not derived from later ‘investors.’” That modus operandi is identified in law as the classic money-laundering Ponzi scheme.

Galbraith is quick to point out, as he advertises, that his is a “debt free” “business” and claims on his pamphlets to be a member of the Canadian Federation of Independent Business. This then begs the question as was put to him . . . “Why if you handle millions of dollars in a debt free operation are you offering 18% to investors for lending you capital when you should in fact be able to secure loans from almost any lending institution for a few percentage points over prime.” His answer, “that he is doing this to help farmers” is neither good business sense nor believable. That answer we find is common to pyramid and Ponzi scheme promoters globally.

The offer of 18% interest in this intended phase of his operations leads irresistibly to the conclusion that this direct “investment” is a “non product” money-laundering Ponzi scheme whereby again; earlier “investors” are paid through the proceeds of later investors. Galbraith indicated he has abandoned that practice in favour of another system whereby he will encourage “sub-contractors” to use their own money recruiting and financing others into the scheme though he will still provide the pigeons. Again a modicum of investigation would reveal that this is a typical money-laundering PYRAMID scheme, also a violation of the before-mentioned laws and regulations. In short, the scheme Galbraith is operating is insolvent. A quick forensic accounting will reveal liabilities simply exceed assets requiring an ever exponentially expanding base of new “investors” in order to fulfill the payment requirements to earlier “investors”.

Many in the pigeon racing, breeding, and production for food operations have been questioning and accusing Galbraith’s operation of being a Pyramid/Ponzi scheme. And now some money lending institutions have begun also to question this “business model” and are now reversing their previous policy of lending. They are refusing to grant loans for customers seeking to become affiliated with Galbraith’s scheme.

As a result of that action these potential buyers/producers (victims) are gravitating to the Scotiabank in Waterloo which appears to be enamored by Galbraith’s apparent “success”. If loans are being granted by Scotiabank to these farmers, Scotiabank will surely find itself in an untenable position as both the lender assisting the perpetrator in encouraging these (as is CBN position) victims to become engaged in money-laundering fraud as well as at the same time acting for the perpetrator of this alleged fraud.

CrimeBustersNow strongly advises, and in fact demands on behalf of the interests of the Canadian public and citizens world-wide, that Scotiabank without delay notify the RCMP, Federal Competition Bureau, the OPP anti-racket squad or whatever law enforcement agencies the Banking Act requires notifying when money-laundering white-collar crime is suspected. To do otherwise may prove problematic when this exponentially expanding Ponzi scheme unravels and collapses. The questions will surely arise . . . “Who knew and when did the know . . . and when were they first informed.”

It is important to this country, North America and the world that these schemes be shut down quickly. The cooperation of Scotiabank in this matter will be greatly appreciated. Please, do feel free to contact us.

cc:
The Honourable Gerry Ritz - Federal Minster of Agriculture Ottawa Canada
The Honourable Leona Dombrowsky - Provincial Minster of Agriculture Ottawa Canada
Canadian Federation of Independent Business - Saskatchewan
Robert FitzPatrick - PSA - Pyramid Scheme Alert - Charlotte, NC. USA
Jon M. Taylor MBA. Ph.D. - CAI Consumer Awareness Institute - Utah USA
Barry Minkow - FDI - Fraud Discovery Institute California





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post Sep 25 2007, 01:56 PM
Post #20
 






posted 9/16/2007 11:55:39 AM by perplexed

Hi Mr. CrimeBustersNow,

I have read your information on Arlan Galbraith. All the information you have given sounds very interesting. However, you have failed to give even a shred of REAL proff that he has done anything wrong! Making accusations like this (without proof) can be a very dangerous thing to do as I’m sure you are well aware...based on the other threads and posts you have on the internet. Having read some of your other posts, I know that you will most likely consider the previous line a threat...IT IS NOT, I am talking about legal action taken against you by those you are accusing. If you have evidence that Mr. Galbraith is laundering money, involved in racketeering and running a Ponzi scheme, please post it for all to see. If Mr. Galbraith was laundering money, whin in the world would he use a Canadian Bank and not an off shore account? Even a dim-witted criminal could figure that one out.
All I would like to see is some unrefutable proof of the accusations you are making against Pigeon King International.

Perplexed.


_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

posted 9/16/2007 5:04:10 AM by mokocyc


Dear Perplexed, I would put the burden of proof on Pigeon King to divulge some reasonable form of investment strategy to assure investors that he is not simply paying earlier investors with present investors money. Since there is no agricultural market for $50.00 pigeons, nor a specialized market to handle the millions of pigeons he is purchasing at exorbitant prices, it is obvious that the payment to earlier investors would have to come from later investors. That is the definition of a Ponzi scheme and it will surely fail when the supply of new investors is overtaken by the obligation to pay earlier investors. If there were some actual way for Pigeon King to make an annual return of 100% on marketing pigeons in order to pay all his investor/raisers then there is nothing to worry about, but rest assured that this is no different from the original Ponzi scheme except that the victims are busy doing something that makes them feel like they are truly making money. In the end the victims will be left with a barn full of worthless pigeons and out their investment money.



_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

posted 9/17/2007 8:40:45 AM by perplexed

Mokocyc,
All I am asking is for David to show us some proof that what PKI is doing is a scheme. Making accusations is the easy part, anyone can do it, but backing it up is another thing. Can you or David show me one person who has been ripped off by PKI? I have seen zero complaints against PKI, including with the BBB. If this were a scam, should there not be some complaints somewhere?



_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

posted 9/16/2007 8:59:34 AM by mokocyc

Dear Perplexed, Because of the nature of a Ponzi scheme it is possible for the scammer to continue with no defaults for an extended period -- sometimes for several years. This is because the stream of new investors with tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars up front can service the payments of early investors who receive small monthly payments. The crunch comes when the exponential growth curve of new investors begins to slow or level off making payments to earlier investors impossible. The entire house of cards collapses immediately, but it is then too late for the majority of investors. There are obvious tell-tale signs of a Ponzi scheme and this one has all the signals blaring loud and clear. They are illegal and here is one that was stopped just two weeks ago before any defaults had occurred: STORY


_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

posted 9/17/2007 11:42:02 AM by CrimeBustersNow

To “Mokocyc” ... Your analysis of this scheme is absolutely accurate in every detail. The Pigeon King International is, by definition, a self evident Ponzi scheme. Thank you for your input on this forum.

Now what is needed to be explained in the broader sense, is how these individual frauds continue to exist for years with the full knowledge our Canadian authorities who steadfastly refuse to act against this white-collar money-laundering racketeering as defined by our Parliament and sent out in the Federal Competition Act, and both section 206 [1] [e] of the Canadian Criminal Code re: Pyramid Scheme; and section 380 of the Canadian Criminal Code: Fraud.

Authorities and private organizations boast of adequately warning the public. But in fact they don’t No where near it. The authorities and those organizations refuse to warn even the high school kids of these specific frauds even when these Canadian schemes are listed in other countries as fraud, or shut down by the highest authorities there. And unbelievably in Canada, authorities will harass, ridicule, threaten and trump up false charges against victims and the very few knowledgeable “whistleblowers” who try to warn others. And that is the only reason CrimeBustersNow was created. The only reason it exists. If the authorities were living up to their fiduciary duties, and the propaganda posted on their websites, and stopped harassing and intimidating victims, CrimeBustersNow would not exist. And that would make me very happy.

dave





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For the Record..
post Sep 27 2007, 03:58 AM
Post #21
 


Pigeon King International Inc. puts breeding pigeons on farms free and buys all offspring back at 8.00 per bird guaranteed for 10 years.
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don't think so
post Sep 27 2007, 08:29 AM
Post #22
 


Interesting -- In their yellow covered recruiting booklet entitled PROFITABLE PIGEON BREEDING CONTRACTS AND BEGINNERS GUIDE I cannot find this option. But, on page 4 you can read the following: “Please study this booklet very carefully. If you are seriously interested and can afford to invest in 100 pairs or more contact the office.”

Do you know of someone who claims they received their pigeons for free? I don’t see that anywhere in the booklet. “If you are seriously interested and can afford to invest in 100 pairs or more contact the office.”

Let’s see, 100 pair x $200.00 = $20,000. MINIMUM

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Yes it is so
post Oct 1 2007, 08:48 AM
Post #23
 


for the record is correct.  Pigeon king International does put flocks out to farmers at no cost to them and pays the $8 per bird that they raise.  I know it for a fact and know that he pays.

just because it isn't in his "yellow book" doesn't mean that it isn't true.

don't think so----can you prove he doesn't

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don't think so
post Oct 1 2007, 10:54 AM
Post #24
 


Alright, I assume that you know someone out there who received breeding stock for free and is selling back to Arlan for $8.00 per bird. This could be entirely true.

This would be what is called the "pigeon dropping." It is the bait that lures the unsuspecting "pigeon" (one who is duped) into the trap. It adds the needed air of legitimacy to the operation in order to pull the "pigeon" in deeper and to attract other "pigeons."

Don't you see that from a business perspective it would actually be much better for Arlan to promote the free breeding stock option.

Option 1)
Purchase Price $200.00
10 year obligation to Producer -- $25.00 per bird
90 offspring @ $25.00 = $2250.00
Net cost to PKI = $2050.00


Option 2)
Purchase Price $500.00
10 year Obligation to Producer -- $50.00 per bird
90 offspring @ $25.00 = $4500.00
Net cost to PKI = $4000.00


Rumored Option 3)
Purchase Price FREE
10 year Obligation to Producer -- $8.00 per bird
90 offspring @ $8.00 = $720.00
Net cost to PKI = $720.00

So you see, PKI would receive back approximately 90 pigeons (per breeding pair) from the producer over the ten year contract with a net cost of either $2050, $4000, or $720. From a business perspective which one should they promote? The one that would make the most money for Pigeon King International, of course. So why isn't it even presented as an option in the PROFITABLE PIGEON BREEDING CONTRACTS AND BEGINNERS GUIDE?

Just think how much more money PKI would make if they signed up breeders at this third option. They would save millions of dollars, no billions - do the math. Even the difference between option 1 and option 2 would be a savings of $200,000 per 100 breeding pair for PKI over the life of the contract.

Could it be that they aren't in it for the long haul? Maybe they need to sell as many $500.00 contacts as they can so they can keep the money pouring in from late investors in order to make payments to earlier investors.

Can't you see how hopelessly stupid the business plan is from the perspective of a real business?

This is a manifestly evident Ponzi scheme. Don't be a "pigeon" and don't eat the "pigeon droppings."

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Yes it is so
post Oct 1 2007, 11:42 AM
Post #25
 


What did you do before crime busters now?  Have you ever owned your own business with hired employees?  Doesn't sound like it to me.  One of the main factors for having people make an investment is that they will take care of it.  If people get something for free they are more apt to be careless and not take care of it.  Sorry but that happens alot!   It is not as simple as you would make it out to be

I have been in business and have had many many employees.  One example is a company vehicle.  Employees vehicle is spotless and in great shape.  Let them drive the companies and they will trash it, run it into the ground and generally don't care what happens to it.

Please answer the question as to what your background in business was.

I have seen your remarks on other sites and you have stated that you have spent over 300 hours researching this company.  However, you have not provided any proof  that thi